The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

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Pete Boole
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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by Pete Boole »

The tapped plate for the forward door mounting bolts is a good idea - I was going to add a third fixing in the middle as well. Although it's not in the photos I assume you're still going to fit the A-post reinforcing plates?

You're right about the doors fighting you - at times you feel like putting a lump hammer through them :twisted:

Pete

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MetBlue
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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by MetBlue »

Pete Boole wrote:
Mon Apr 20, 2020 06:00
I was going to add a third fixing in the middle as well.
A third M6 bolt on this same plate? I'm using an early door and the web of fibre glass is very thin. Barely room for another fixing, but I might take a closer look. The tapped plate is a mod I'd highly recommend to everyone. It was only when I sat down to post last night that I realised it had turned a 3 hand job into 2. Without it, I'd have been continually calling on help from "indoors".
Assume you mean the plate holding the Vac Accumulator when you speak of the re-inforcing plate. Yes, that's going back, but only when all the work on the doors is finished, they are fixed and aligned. I don't know about everyone else's car, but on mine, there were huge quantities of thin large washers between the fibre glass and the plate to pack it away and level it up, the plate has very large holes in it and a single Nylok secures the hinge, all these washers and the plate. The washers were so dished, it's amazing they clamped anything in the right place.

The 1/2" ID washers I had to space the hinge pin with to align the bolt holes are bothering me. Do others have the same need on your cars? It makes perfect sense that they would be their, and they would give far more vertical adjustment that you'd get with the washers around the bush pin, But they are not referenced in the manual, nor on the RD Enterprises parts lists ( and I'm sure my car was "bodged" together without them).
Tony
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Pete Boole
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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by Pete Boole »

I'm welding large O/D M10 washers to both sides of the A-post plate to locate it better over the door hinge bolts. It will still need spacing though because the bobbins in the A-post aren't always at the same depth.

The spacing of your hinge pins with 1/2" washers is fine; otherwise the brackets would get pulled out of alignment the minute you tightened up the hinge pin nuts, with all that force going into the fibreglass as well.

I'll probably do what I did on the Excel and make the hinge pin removable by having bolts go into it from top and bottom. Once you've got the hinge brackets in the right place the last thing you want to do is to undo them again if you need to remove the door for some reason (can't think of a reason, but there might be one!). With the standard hinge pin you can't get it out without removing at least one bracket.

A third bolt at the front would be between the existing two - plenty of room. Just belt and braces.

Pete

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MetBlue
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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by MetBlue »

I'm more than happy with mechanical integrity of the Vertical pin spacer arrangement I now have. What surprises me is that it isn't documented anywhere in the service manual or parts lists.
Am just curious if other cars are like it, or if being an early car, Lotus got the bobbin positions wrong.

Tony
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Pete Boole
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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by Pete Boole »

Slight thread hijack: Tony - while you're working with your A-post reinforcing plates can you tell me how long the spacers are that go over the captive nuts that are there to secure the bonnet release lever? I've lost mine at some time over the last two years! Thanks :D

Pete

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MetBlue
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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by MetBlue »

Pete : These spacers must be like socks. Take off to clean and never seen as a pair again. Saw your question last night, knowing that mine were also AWOL.
Good news though. It forced me to dig deep, and hey presto, there in the footwell with 2 M6 bolts were a pair of tube spacers.
They are 16.5 mm ID ( but this isn't really enough to clear the nut weld, so they are slightly oval).
OD is 3/4 "
Length 20mm.

If the pivot bush has gone absent also, it's 12 mm total length, with shoulder 8.5 mm long. ID 7mm, Main OD 16mm. Spigot OD 9.6mm.
Tony
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Pete Boole
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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by Pete Boole »

Brilliant! Thanks Tony. I can get some more made now. Funnily enough I still have the shouldered pivot bush and the rest of the bits.

Pete

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MetBlue
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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by MetBlue »

Having found these parts, you've got me thinking. I seem to recall having trouble keeping these tight when car was on the road.
Having 6 mm bolts through such a large tube is very poor design. I think I'm now going to ditch these spacers and make a 20 mm spacer with 6.5 mm holes and only open up locally on the rear to clear the nut welds.
---- But I've read enough of your post to know how your mind works, and I've got a kind of feeling you are ahead of me on this one
Tony
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Pete Boole
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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by Pete Boole »

I'm ahead of you on that one, as you guessed!! I just can't stop fixing all the bits Lotus could have done a better job of in the first place.

Pete

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MetBlue
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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by MetBlue »

Update on the dreaded door build. In short, lived up to expectations :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
This was a test build for the drivers door, main intent to be confident in re-bond the two shell halves correctly, knowing i would be able to maintain good door alignment ( There was up to 5mm of packing in some area's between the inner and outer skin found during strip down) . Did I need to replicate it ?
First the good.
After a logical build process that I won't go into here ( time permitting I'll do a separate thread one day), I'd got the beam hung, the shell on, nicely aligned to front and rear wing panels and the window frame in place ( without glass for simplicity, but I don't think it will have compromised anything). Fitted the door seal and proceeded looking around with torch one side, looking for light to come through between door and seal. After one minor shim adjustment on the frame, I had good compression on the seal up both sides and along the top edge. I was confident to bond the two skins back together directly. Job jobbed - Or so I thought.
Now the bad news:
The sills are currently off, so took a gander along the bottom door edge to check seal. --- What seal ?---- Not only could I see light coming through, I could even see the torch !!! As built, there is a gap around 3mm wide running pretty much the full length of the door lower edge. !!! The gap is in both vertical and horizontal planes ( i.e. Bottom edge of door needs to be lower, and closer the the car body) I'd got a grubby length of 25mm , 3mm thick right angled Ali hanging around, and had no trouble at all in inserting between the seal and the door. Not easy to photograph, best attempt below. View is from the floor, looking up at underside of door. The screw is holding it in place temporarily, so I could ensure nothing else will clash.
Image
So now I have to build up and out the bottom of the door significantly. Two lengths of angle ordered up to form the basis of this. With the sill on, I couldn't have seen this. I can't see any explanation for this, and am pretty sure that this gap must have been present since it's initial build.
Two other problems to consider along side this.
* The grommet hole into the body for the electric window cable is so close to the leading edge of the door when door is open, that the door will contact it. = Probably will end up moving the hole inboard more.
* When the door opens, it is VERY close to the body before the door leading edge enters the large concave area. - And I mean close. Door is not yet painted, and literally, just the thickness of the paint will mean I have contact :cry: I don't want to move the door back more, as already the gap at front to the body is close to twice the width of the gap at the back, ( but it doesn't look too bad and they are parallel).

Anyone else experience any of these issues? I have solutions for 2, but that front end door clash on opening is bothering me. I could push the door in slightly, but then I'd have a leading edge sitting in board of the front wing :!: :!: :!:
Overall though, I'm please with how it went. Progress comes in small steps.
Tony
What goes together.... Must come apart.

Pete Boole
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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by Pete Boole »

Before I had my shell sprayed I re-profiled the concave section at the rear of the wing to allow the door gap to be reduced a little without scraping on the top and bottom edges of that bit. I'm worried that with the paint on it now it will still be super-close. Is the leading edge of your door straight?

Pete

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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by MetBlue »

Pete Boole wrote:
Thu Apr 23, 2020 10:57
Is the leading edge of your door straight?
Door front edge is straight. Parking the problem for now and I'll see what the other side looks like, then do something I know will work for both sides.

All gone a bit quiet on door front last week. Waiting on materials to close the gap along bottom edge. Once door beam was fitted though, I could feel wear in the hinge bushes. Not massive, maybe a couple of mm at latch and that was dry, so maybe would have all but disappeared when I pumped the grease in, but would be silly to leave unattended. Now waiting on new bushes from SJ. Have knocked out the old bushes on passenger beam ready for delivery. Was reading recently on forum about needing to line ream bushes (a service LB offer), but also that it was possible to hone out the SJ bush with emery wrapped around a drill. Same post also spoke of SJ bushes being Stainless though which I can't believe. Surely they are Oilite or phosper bronze ? Are there two types of bushes out there? I'll find out later this week hopefully which SJ supply.

One small bit of progress. Prompted by Pete's request on spacers for the bonnet release, I made up a proper clamp plate to go between the Lotus made bracket and the Door plate ( Who ever thought putting M6 bolts through a 19mm tube was a good design - must have been a Friday afternoon job given to a first year apprentice and no one noticed until it was too late). Also added a Shoulder bolt behind the lever back stop tab as this is a very week area, tending to bend back (It's going nowhere now !!!). The other ends of the cables are not attached, hence able to leave lever forward in "release" position in photo to better show tab and supporting shoulder bolt.

Image

Might only be a small step, but in a strange way, seeing the trim piece roughly in place and an operable bonnet lever felt like major progress ( even if it does have to all come apart again :!: :!: :!:). You know what they say about eating elephants....
What goes together.... Must come apart.

Pete Boole
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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by Pete Boole »

If the bushes turn out to be stainless send them back! If you need to ream them don't forget you'll also need a pilot to suite the adjustable reamer. I think honing with a wet & dry-wrapped drill bit you may end up with less accurate bushes than you've already got unless you pilot that accurately as well. Hopefully the bushes will be a good fit in the beam and for the hinge pin. They are from SJ's though!! :roll:

I like the extra lever stop on your bonnet release mechanism - good plan. I'm not sure why the tabs get bent on the original bracket - if the cables are adjusted correctly.

Eating elephants??!

Pete

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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by MetBlue »

Desmond Tutu once wisely said that “there is only one way to eat an elephant: a bite at a time.” What he meant by this is that everything in life that seems daunting, overwhelming, and even impossible can be accomplished gradually by taking on just a little at a time.

- And no, I didn't know the Desmond Tutu connection, but just googled it to make sure it wasn't my imagination running wild.

Quite apt for anyone working on Lotus though :lol: :lol: :lol:
What goes together.... Must come apart.

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MetBlue
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Re: The longest Elite Resto ? - probably

Post by MetBlue »

Still waiting on parts for doors, so thought I'd take the Roll bar out to give a lick of paint.
Anyone successfully took one out? It's all loose now, but door recess stops it moving forward at the top, and rear quarter light rebate stops the bar if you try pulling the lowest part backwards.

The only thing I could think to do, is tie the lower area together with a draw bar and give it a squeeze, but I get the feeling I'd over strain it and put a permanent set in it. It needs to move alot to come free of the window rebate.

It's in decent condition, so unless someone on forum has a solution, it's likely to be left. :( :( :(

Tony
What goes together.... Must come apart.

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